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Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 4:54 am
by Onix
I'm *see title* and thinking that this goes a long way to explain a lot of the ideas in game. Especially Gaia. It really should be updated and put into a PDF. It's a lot of information and most people wouldn't be interested in reading the logic of all the physics but the information is useful. Maybe have a crib sheet for it in the main book and reference the tech book if the players want more.

In the general populace I'd say 0 of 0 people would really read through it but lets face it, the RPG community has a few geeks and nerds (raising my hand) that would get into it. I think it makes a lot of the terms used more understandable.

All I've gotta say is. . . Really? You had to go and re-invent physics? I like it!

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:18 am
by Rob Lang
Onix, thank you! I'm glad someone has read it other than Byrn, Fish and I. I was tempted to include that in Version 4, but as you rightly point out it's a bit kitchen sink to do so. A cheat sheet is a good idea but what do I include? You start explaining something (everything is an energy pattern) and suddenly you're explaining the three media, their differences and how that applies to space flight, energy weapons and so on. Choosing scope is quite a difficult problem!

Instead of including any of it in the rules, I shall be including descriptions of what technology is possible and what is not. Most of it can be justified using the base principles, some of the bits will be "IT JUST IS OK?". ;) I think those "You can do this but not this.." sorts of descriptions might be more useful and then for the clan of Nerds (of which I think we're both members) there will be the deeper science.

You're right that it needs to be in a PDF. And the words are already in one! However, when doing the pictures, I realised that I needed to concentrate on the Core rules. If I try to do anything but Version 4, there will be mobs wielding torches outside my house demanding to see 'the forehead'! :D

What would you say your level of scientific knowledge? I tried to aim it at 'GCSE' level (which are exams taken at the age of 16 in the UK). I can't say if I hit that. Once I get the PDF done, I'll see if the Mrs can get through it - my dearest wife isn't really sciencey at all.

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 8:15 am
by Onix

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 8:22 am
by Onix
One more thought, I know it might pain you to do it but you might have to anchor some terms into common parlance. For example, explain the three media as something like other dimensions and then stick to calling them dimensions. I know that stinks but more people will understand it and can move on to the next unknown.

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 8:49 am
by Rob Lang
I know what you mean by common parlance and have moved Version 4 across to common terms for Attributes and skill checks (thanks to Viziel!)

However, 'Dimensions' is actually the wrong word. A parallel dimension (or ) suggests that it is separate from other dimensions. You move from one dimension into another. In this case, reality is actually made up from a number of , which are super-imposed over each other. There is only one reality. They are intrinsically connected but humanity naturally can only sense and understand the first medium.

I can see that you could see this as separate, parallel dimensions but there is too much intellectual baggage attached to these terms - it is easier to use the correct term and explain it properly rather than try and change people's understanding of parallel dimensions. For example, most people think that parallel dimensions can have different histories but the three mediums do not. They share the same histories and there can be no divergence. Also, you can't really travel between the three mediums (I now know it's actually mediums, not media), as you exist in all three at once.

Although the first two dimensions could be well re-branded as a parallel dimension, the third cannot. The third medium is a way of looking at the entire universe as its energy patterns. They are superimposed without width, breadth or length.

It will definitely be explained better in the next version of the book (which will be called Science to differentiate from technology in Version 4) but I can't change the name of that.

Is there anything else you feel might be improved?

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 9:18 am
by Onix
I was thinking more of the Up-Down Left-Right Forwards-Backwards use of Dimensions but yeah, people could think of Parallel Universes and that could cause some confusion but I still don't think it would give such a wrong idea that it would throw the whole thing. I know it's not the right word for it but it would be an intellectual bridge. Still I know it's hard not to use the right terms.

As far as other suggestions, I think that the information on using Gaia should be separate from the science. It's more functional and belongs by itself or as it's own section and written without considering the science. There are a lot of players that would be fine with just thinking (incorrectly) that Gaia is the internet and just use it as such. In practice it wouldn't matter. I know thats annoying but it makes it accessible.

I have a lot of thoughts or questions as to how the limits to this science (and tech) are presented. A simple one is, that it's stated that you cannot be killed in Gaia. I originally applauded this because I was incorrectly thinking of Cyberpunk or Matrix terms, now I'm not so sure. If I'm in an immersive simulation and surrounded by hard light objects, I understand that there would be safeguards but what if my terminal is hacked and the safeguards removed maliciously? Any safety real or virtual can be circumvented.

Another is if energy is essentially free (thinking of the generators) why have starships? Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but can full energy patterns be pushed into the third media and then extracted again? Is this how you teleport ammo in the game? If so, wouldn't it be possible to teleport anywhere in the universe? I may have that all wrong, I'm pulling thoughts from different books and trying to incorporate them.

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:52 am
by Rob Lang

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:16 pm
by viziel
OMG, if you are gonna put this in your game make sure you include...at least...pictures.

You lost me after "This is a good point, made often. " :lol:

Facinating however...I've always been a fan of the 'brane theory of parallel universes and how the big bang was actually the collision of 'branes....

On the topic of parallel universes. I always enjoyed the idea that they dont have to be similar, that the 'rules' of one dimension may not apply to another.

What I wonder about is the application of 'warp' space to most sci-fi genre. The idea is that space-time or the 'fabric' of space is warped such that the ship is able to slip into a jet-stream allowing faster ..potentially unimpeded...travel.

What the sending of particles through space-time via these devices be something akin to these unique dimensions which have the properties that give the desired effects?

Do parallel universes have to be similar?

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 2:24 pm
by Rob Lang
Viz, I already have!

http://www.icar.co.uk/download.php?section=background

Scroll right to the bottom, it's the last in the list.

Re: Reading through the technology pages

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:06 pm
by Onix