Quick Thoughts On Moving RPGs Into The 21st Century

[Onix]

With the discussion of StartRolePlaying.com and Why RPGs Suck I occasionally have a few ideas pop into my head on moving past the current industry model. There are three problems that I see.

RPGs have a steep learning curve. Really it only takes one to four hours to get past it and start having fun but this makes it hard to introduce new players.

RPGs are based on ancient technology (also known as "books"). Even updated technologies like PDFs are essentially easy to distribute books.

RPG have a large amateur developer body but they are all headed in random directions. Unlike the Linux movement that has a large amateur developer body but are organized to head in one direction.

I think some of these issues are starting to be addressed but others are not. For instance the idea of unifying the amateur masses would generally be looked on as impossible (herding cats). But maybe not if the motivation was changed.

I have some specific ideas that I'd like to share but I'd like to hear first what you might think about these as being the core issues to tackle and if you know of solutions that have been tried or that you would like to see tried.

[Chainsaw Aardvark]

[Onix]

[Chainsaw Aardvark]

A good number of these tools are already available, though perhaps less than accessible. I'm pretty sure there are already "people seeking players" sites but we don't necessarily know where to look for them. Same for the GMing blogs - there are a lot of gaming web journals, so its easy to be overwhelmed before you find what you need.

I would consider myself fairly good with mechanics, and have a Bachelor of the Arts in English Literature and Creative Writing, so if you need a story/editor/system - just ask me. But once again, I'm not advertised across the we and available to anyone besides those on the 1km1kt forums.

Oh, and I found this a little while ago, hopefully its helpful as well.

So far as art is concerned, I know of the SF and Fantasy collection. However, I have never collaborated with an artist before, so I can't say how you would ask someone from that site about assisting you or how the joint effort should proceed. We need something rather like 1km1kt, but for game artists I guess.

Despite D&D's legendary complexity, in the late 70s/early 80s it was split into basic for the first three levels, and then you moved on to the AD&D set. Perhaps more games need to be designed form the ground up to add new mechanics as you level up, rather than assuming everything is available at the start.

Like a game for pre-teen heroes. It starts off with them just hitting bad-guys and sneaking about. As they get older/level up, they get their driver's licenses (add driving rules), study martial arts (new hand to hand moves), develop powers, and are eventually able to purchase fire arms (ranged combat). (No CA, you have enough projects in the works, designing another one)

For a more basic fantasy game - everyone starts off as a generic adventure/fighter - but then you graduate to other classes by dint of learning attending a university in game.

[Onix]

I know that the Forge and a few other places have forums for offering services like playtesting and on occasion art or writing and I think the playtesting is usually negotiated by saying "You receive a copy of the game and will be mentioned in the credits". And that works because most of the playtesters are looking for a free game and some recognition. Illustrators and writers tend to be a bit harder. Not only because they're putting a lot more work into the project (and would actually prefer getting paid) but because most designers and freelance artists aren't used to collaborating and don't know how to structure the collaboration.

Now this is where the Linux comparison comes in. Most developers for Linux are collaborating with the work that has come before them. They understand that they're adding to a body of work but also understand that if enough people like what they do, they have a lot of freedom within that collaboration. The trick is getting RPG designers to understand that the writers and artists need that latitude to feel like they're properly expressing themselves. I have some ideas on how to do that but would require a lot of explanation.

Secondly when a Linux developer writes a module, they don't just get recognition from people using that module (in our case like getting credits in a book) they get recognition from the entire (ok most of the) Linux community. Replicating that would be an great way of rewarding someone that has collaborated on a lot of projects. Like Experience Points.

I have more on that thought but want to pause there to get thoughts on it so far.

Edit: BTW thanks for the offer for writing and mechanics, I'd like to take you up on the offer but to my point, I'd like to find a way to compensate your effort and do something in return.

[Onix]

Okay so maybe there's not much to this thought of interest since there isn't much of a reaction. I'll push ahead with the subject a little here and if there's no traction, I'll drop it.

I thought of the idea of rewarding contributors by giving them some kind of a point system on a website like RPG Laboratory. For RPGs Experience Points just fits and people would instantly recognize it's function. Like a rank on a message board, the XP system would instantly tell people how helpful someone has been.

But that isn't a big reward or anything, so then I thought, what do you do with XP? Spend them. You would keep a running total of the XP you've earned but you would spend them to get help with your projects.

For example, I contribute something good to Icar (Pictures, Settings, Story, Etc) and Rob would pay me out of his XP pool.

Now I have some XP that I can offer to contributors and if someone wants to submit material they can. I would review it and If I liked it, I would give them XP for their work. Now they can get more help with their project.

A few other thoughts on how someone would get XP. All material contributed would be viewable by other members and they could rate the material. Each rating would give a small amount of XP, so even if a contribution isn't accepted for a project, the contributor can still see some benefit from it. It might be great stuff, but I can't afford to accept it because 30 pictures were submitted and I only can "pay" for 4.

Now here comes the other thought and it goes way back to those discussions of universal systems. Say I write a mechanic for computer hacking (It readily pops into my head because I've been working on that) but it doesn't strongly rely on any one central mechanic. I can offer that as a mechanism that anyone can pay for and use, even if someone else has already used it. This could even work for artwork. A picture of a barbarian or T-Rex is pretty generic and could be offered as stock art.

Offerings like this would pay fewer XP per use than one that was tailor written for a specific game (say 1/3rd) but if picked up multiple times it would eventually pay more.

I guess there would have to be some kind of complaint system to handle someone plagiarizing a highly rated work.

Does that make sense? Would you use a service like that?

My thought also is that someone with a lot of XP might be of interest to a company that would be able to pay them. Kind of like a RPG resume but thats just a side thought.

[Chainsaw Aardvark]

That is a rather interesting idea. However, it may be a bit hard to implement.

For one, we don't have a central bank to monitor this sort of thing, or a real way to set XP prices.

Another is most of us are producing free stuff because we're philanthropists. If we're not looking for real money with real world applications, then fake credit only good for a limited community doesn't seem like an incentive. Simple reciprocity without the need for numbers seems sufficient.

Perhaps it would be better to create the "All Encompassing Directory of Free Game Designers". It could list a Curriculum Vitae of projects (completed, in process, and contributed to), as well as with what you can lend a help with (setting design, mechanics ideas, art, etc.) and if you've been published. Actual written recommendations from others in the community or reviews on various sites (like Robs) coupled with a finished game or two are probably a better resume to show publishers than something akin to forum rank.

As a slightly revised version of the concept, rather than a monetary system, how about a sort of RPG stock market? Some variation of open development where you can declare that you "like a project" and can submit artwork or invest suggestions to get it finished. A non-monetary version of . I suppose there can be dividends paid not just as a "thank-you" on the cover page - but recognition in game - ie contributors appear as major NPCs, or in the background history.

[Onix]

[cjoki]

This reminds me of experts exchange. I tech website that had a point system to allow you to ask tech question of the other members. Each question asked has a point value assigned by the poster which is then handed out to the person with the accepted answer and also reducing your pool of points. To gain more points (it used to do this) you could wait while you earned a 1/2 point per day or you can visit the forum and answer other members questions.

For example I have a background in php, javascript, html and mysql. But I may have a question about queries in mssql for a project I have and that I am stuck on. So I post a question and make a guess as to how difficult the question is AND how soon I need an answer. I get 3 response and one answer works. I accept that poster as being correct and he is awarded the points. Now that member may have the points to ask a question on raid 5 on a SAS disk array and it continues on and on.

I have since stop using experts exchange because they want you to pay for access, something I can not do since there are other places I can visit like The code project and they do not charge.

[Onix]

In your opinion, did the system work (without the pay for part)? What were the disadvantages that you observed?

I've often seen experts exchange on searches but I never signed up. As far as money goes, I figure a system like Instructables could work. Using the system is free but you have advertisements. If you pay for a membership, you don't have to look at ads. They also will give you a "Pro Membership" if they feature your stuff and run a lot of competitions where you can win a "Pro" status which rewards good contributors and therefore draws traffic.

I've also been thinking about this as a general tool for projects, rather than just for RPGs. The reason I have for doing that is because it could help with some of the video ideas that have been discussed in the StartRolePlaying.com thread. If the site attracted animators that could collaborate with musicians to make their videos, then they could, using the same or similar systems be enticed into helping. That becomes a far more ambitious a project at that point, the "pricing" problems that CA mentioned are far greater.