Dinosaur Cowboys skirmish game

[Evil Scientist]

Nice report! Loved the "old vs new paintjob" photo. Something I can totally relate to.

It'd be a good idea to add the overall duration of the game to your reports, in my opinion it's important for somebody who'd like to try Dinousaur Cowboys - does it play in an hour? Two hours?

[bosky]

Yeah it's funny what 10 years of off-and-on painting will do to help keep colors in the lines. I'm always surprised by how many mistakes an up close camera shot shows me.

Good point on the length, I used to record that in some of the earlier session reports. The only issue with gauging accurate game length is the photo taking normally doubles the time. In this case the game was a little over an hour, but in total was closer to two. And even after all that half the photos came out fuzzy, haha. Time for a new camera I think.

[bosky]

Hey all, I thought I'd drop back into my old topic to ask another question, instead of starting a whole new thread.

Before I do that I thought I'd pimp the recent battle reports I had, first a and then the more recent . Plus a new release of the rulebook, . Oh and I got some hecka snazzy plastic tokens made from Litko.

Annnnnnyways, I'm starting to brainstorm a standalone campaign that includes a sandbox style overland map with some general goals. I think I'll have to flesh out some of the existing campaign rules for things like difficult overland terrain, night fighting, etc. But my question is around post-game injury tables.

Currently after a battle, win or lose, any members killed/taken out of action bounce back to full Hitpoints and are a-okay. What I was considering implementing is something similar to Mordheim or Necromunda where you roll on an injury table after the game to see what permanent damage (if any) was done. This would probably be in the form of statistic penalties and the like. Sounds great and realistic right?

My main concern is the "death spiral", where a posse or character can become so crippled that they are basically guaranteed to get killed in every subsequent game.

What do you think I could do to get around this? Maybe just apply temporary penalties for some of their next game? I kind of like the idea of something beyond just a flat stat penalty, like maybe a bad blow to the head leaves them Dazed and they have to move a little randomly until that injury heals up.

Or I could just leave it as is, where everyone is back to 100% after each fight. There is already a subtle penalty to losing in the sense that you don't get as much money or improvement points as you would with a win, so your posse advances slower.

[kylesgames]

What you could do is what I'm trying with my Advanced Player's Guide for The Last Band; if you're injured or need repairs you can take extra time off in order to be able to leave at full strength; but you miss out on particularly urgent missions and you have to pay upkeep for your characters while they're down. They can be allowed to go into debt as well, meaning that they have to pay off that from any missions they take from that area before they get their own cut.

However, this means that they can suffer penalties for the next battle if they don't want to take long enough to rest up, or they can rest for a while though it'll cost a bit.

[Onix]

My question would be, is a death spiral really undesirable? I'm pretty ruthless when it comes to player deaths so maybe I'm not the best gauge, but I'd look at it as being more realistic.

On the other hand, maybe if one posse is weakened, the other posse sends fewer members after them thinking they're finished anyway. This voluntary reduction could give a bonus like a chance at finding a cool weapon or wild dino. In effect the winning player would gimp themselves for a chance at a cool in game reward.

[bosky]

@kylesgames: Interesting idea, but I don't know if it'll be a good fit since a Dinosaur Cowboys campaign is structured similarly to D&D or other RPGs. Generally you have an overland map you can wander around, fighting random foes, completing missions at the Sheriffs (DMs) discretion, etc. So sitting out for any length of time would be quite a detriment, and might be hard to make a fluff reason for how its even possible. I guess "they stay at camp" works, unless it's in a remote or dangerous area.

@Onix: Haha you monster, the death spiral is such a bummer for some players. My worry is that the death spiral wouldn't be on a character-by-character basis as much as a posse wide basis, and that would take longer to happen. You might struggle for five or six games before injury penalties really gimp you to the point of always losing.
btw did you ever get a chance to try out the game or playtest it? I remember you mentioning a few pages back that you might if you get the time.

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I think generally the cost of replacing an injured or dead posse member can be prohibitive (compared to a game like Mordheim or Necromunda). When you get a $30/kill reward but it costs $250 to recruit someone (without any equipment) the death spiral is easy to slip into.

I might just go with temporary effects that apply for the first turn of the next encounter. That way you still feel the last loss, but it doesn't guarantee that you're screwed for the next game. To keep the penalties consistent I'll probably just stick to the negative effects weapons can apply, like Stopped, Slowed, etc. It can be reasoned as "Your character has an injured leg that is on the mend. He'll be Slowed [half move] for the first turn of your next encounter".

Thanks for the ideas so far!

[Onix]

Unfortunately I haven't, which stinks because I really want to. I need to plan out when I could.

[bosky]

[Evil Scientist]

Just had this idea for a scenario - a posse's dinosaur is captured by their rivals and is kept in a cage. This could be turned into an inflitration mission, with night fight rules, sneaking etc.

[bosky]

That's a good idea, especially because I could lighten the mood by having the dinosaur be stolen by a travelling circus. I used to play a lot of games of Warhammer 40k (2nd edition) along these lines, with preset patrol routes for guards, probing spotlights, sentries in high towers and so on. I think it's a perfect scenario to be lead by a gamemaster (aka the Sheriff) instead of an opposing player since then I wouldn't have to worry about balance.
I've just been thinking of some night fight rules so this would be a good push to get those finalized. Here's my brainstorming so far on it:

- Night rules
-- Need to be simple since they will be used half the time
-- Maybe limit ranges to 10", penalty beyond that?
-- Or shift range bracket penalties, so no penalty at Short Range, -1 at Medium, can't shoot at Long?
--- Need to factor in weapons with no short range (Lever Action Rifle)
- Make more light sources available
-- Easier to shoot with a light source but also to be shot
--- Increase max range, but also let enemies ignore penalties to hit you