Defense Rolls

[Onix]

I wanted to get some thoughts from the monkeys on this.

I've been considering the idea of players getting a defense roll for a turn that applies to everyone trying to attack them. There are two main problems with this idea. One if you roll really badly for that turn, you're probably going to take a beating. Nice when the NPC gets it, not so nice when you get it. Two, if you roll really well, no one can touch you. That could be annoying if an NPC keeps rolling well, of course you'd be happy to have that problem but it makes the game less challenging and kind of boring if you can engineer a character to consistently get this.

So why would I like to make this work? It would speed up turns and make PbP easier.

I'm thinking that normally a character gets a free defense roll for a round but they have to pay for any other rolls they make in a turn with "actions". Normally your actions are used to attack but if that your defense roll stunk, you could use actions to make more defense rolls until you were satisfied. Unfortunately that could result in a character build that cannot be hit because they use a bunch of defense rolls.

Any ideas or examples that might guide me through this mess?

[BubbaBrown]

In my system, for attack-defense combinations that make sense, the attacker rolls first and if it is a valid threat the defender then rolls.

The one problem with an overall roll for the turn is that it can be too encompassing, especially when the number of enemies is pretty high. I'd be tempted to roll defense rolls per attack rolls that have a chance to do something. I'm assuming you have some static scores for defense that are applied to rolls. For optimization purposes, if an attack roll exceeds the static scores, the defender then rolls to defend.

It'll increase rolling, but give more variance in the statistics so a few chained awesome rolls don't have a character untouchable to a horde for a battle, and it would give characters a chance to redeem themselves after one flubbed roll.

[kylesgames]

I'm working on this for the larger Aduelle setting:

I'm thinking about doing a defense roll that is static, but modified by positioning; part of this is the fact that the Aduelle system is built to work around multiple quick modifier additions.

The system I've come up with is this: Each turn you roll 2d8+9 for defense (4d8 is the normal roll, but this is less likely to flop and pretty similar in terms of final results), and add a bonus for your character's Agility, Dodge, an appropriate combat skill, shield, or magical protection, and Posturing, which basically is determined by your current combat status (powerful attacks reduce it, conservative fighting increases it) and allows for a fair degree of flexibility with a result range of 11-25 on the dice and anywhere from 0-16 in modifiers (for normal non-legendary mortals).

[Onix]

[bender42]

You could just dispense of the roll altogether, (strength+skill+weapon+d20 has to be higher than defense). Alternatively, you could give the character an armor value, and have them add a d4, d6, or d10 depending on how good the character is at combat. For some of my homebrew games, I have two rolls for the attacker, one to see if the attack gets past the defenders defense skill, and an additional one to see if it penetrates the defenders armor.

[Onix]

[bender42]

Rereading the post, one of the options isn't all that different. The to hit, then to wound option is still a somewhat valid, if simplified way of doing it.

[Chainsaw Aardvark]

I recall a similar system being used in uni-system, but since I don't have my AFMBE books next to me at the moment, I'll refer you to some rpg.net reviews by of AFMBE and Buffy (Each of which which use slightly different versions of the rules - horror vs cinematic) If I'm remembering correctly, in Buffy you had the option of accepting a static average rather than rolling. (Partly to mitigate risk of a low roll, and often to speed up fights involving a lot of minor opponents) Meanwhile, AFMBE was roll vs target number, not the opponent's roll, to hit, and then dodge was to get out of the way if it did hit.

As an option, the dodge roll only applies to a certain source or the first enemy, and then the returns begin to diminish. Staying behind the car protects you from the guys on the other side, but not the ones who are coming around to flank you. Similarly, you can block one punch, but when you're dog-piled by six guys, someone is going to get a hit in. So perhaps the full value is only applied to one attack for one attack or direction, and after that there is some set or percentage penalty. (-2 per additional attack, or -50% against flank, -75% against back-stab for example.)

It could be argued that this phenomenon is self-regulating. A good roll might make the character untouchable on round one, but can they reasonably expect to roll 30s every round? Sooner or later, luck will run out.

It is possible to include special maneuvers into the system that can either boost a low roll or help diminish a high one. As mentioned before, flanking would counteract a good defense, while laying down suppressive fire might not hit anything, but would make the enemy unwilling to charge your low defense.

[vulpinoid]

This probably doesn't help much, but I've been toying with a system that combines attack and defense into a single "combat strategy roll".

Basically, you roll a d10 with modifiers. For every whole multiple of 3 you get a strategy point (2 or less = 0 strategy, 3-5 = 1 strategy, 6-8 = 2 strategy, 9-11 = 3 strategy, 12+ = 4 strategy).

Fighters might get a natural bonus to their rolls, wearing heavy armour might make you less manouverable as give you a penalty to your roll, a character with "jungle fighting" might gain an automatic startegy point if they are in a dense wooded environment...etc. Characters automatically gain +1 to their die roll for every specific opponent in the fight (Why?...I'll get to that shortly).

The roll is done once at the beginning of a round. You then spend a strategy point to automatically attack or defend. If someone spends a point to attack and their victim does not spend a point to defend, the attack gets through. Roll damage. Damage is a flat roll (plus a weapon strength, minus an armour resilience).

This way players have to decide if their characters are on the offensive or the defensive during a round.

Why the extra points for extra combatants? If a character is surrounded by enemies, a single swipe might do more damage to closely packed opponents. Or maybe they can focus their strikes on a cluster of enemies. This also gives them a slightly better opportunity to avoid a few more incoming attacks in a single round. It's designed to be more cinematic than realistic, it also allows certain combative characters to gain a bonus skill where they might gain +2 on their strategy rolls for each opponent instead of +1 (perhaps they are used to fighting when outnumbered). The bonus gained for extra opponents is never enough to completely outweigh their numeric advantage, but it can be enough to allow characters a sporting chance.

There's plenty of nuances in this, but I won't go further into it in case it just derails the thread.

[Onix]