Mixed Emotions on the "Piledrivers and Powerbombs"

[Andy K]

From Here:


It was essentially my intention with starting the 24 Hour RPG project that the authors leave the "24 hour" version of their game, the usually unpolished and unedited version, on the site for... well... eternity. If they were to publish the game, the author would undoubtedly add more content, polish up and edit the work and the like, before attempting to resell.

The main heavyweight in this dept that convinced me of this opinion is Phil Reed (who organized the first few 24 Hour RPGs). He wrote "vs Monsters" in 24 hours. From that point, he kept his initial offering free- it's still available for free today.

Later, he polished his work up and not only made a version that was "For Pay", he also published a hardcopy version for something like $20 that ended up selling like hotcakes. The revised, published "vs Monsters" got lots of critival acclaim and even made the final nominations for several RPG awards.

So here's my thoughts, please weigh in with what you think:

Note: Pile&Power doesn't fit these thoughts, as it slipped through the crack before I could think of an official policy:

1) I should not worry about it. It's the author's content, they should do what they want with it.

2) I should get the author to sign a limited rights agreement, basically stating that they can do whatever they want with their game, but allowing us (and 1km1kt) to keep an archived version of the "24 hour rpg", indefinitely.

3) I should reinforce to the author, when they submit their game, that "all the cool kids" are leaving us a copy of their 24 Hour RPG version of their game, and that it's generally "in bad taste" (or somesuch) to request that it be removed.

Now, for Pile&Power, above, I'm glad that they're getting published and all... but since there's undoubtedly more content (and probably art, etc to boot), I don't see why they can't leave the 24 Hour version alive for archival purposes- To essentially support the project that "made" their work.

I'd hate to create a "policy" or "legalease" stating that you sign over the rights or whatever for future authors, rather relying on "peer culture" to help the authors understand why they should leave their works available.

But, worst case scenario, say that someone decides to "Pull a Gleichman*"- That would be a lot of work for us- A pain in the ass, and it would detract from the event in the end.

What to do... what to do...

Thoughts?

-Andy

*Referring to the legendary Brian Gleichman- He "left the internet" at one point because of criticism, and went to every RPG forum that he posted to and systematically deleted all the posts that he ever wrote. This had the effect of swiss-cheesing hundreds of conversations at The Forge as well as RPGNet.

[Simon W]

Well, I always thought that the idea was that the original work stayed available here, as a record of the 24-hour project.

I'm working on DreamKnights (originally Dreamscape) and 1940_England Invaded (maybe even have-a-go-heroes) and will publish both of those in much more complete format. However, I intend to leave the originals here.

I'm sure it is more a question of etiquette rather than anything else, because it would be difficult to enforce if someone was insistent that you remove their work.

In P&P's case, I was very surprised at the speed in which a 24-hour game became a fully-fledged saleable venture.

Edit: I certainly don't think anyone who has asked for their game to be removed should have any reference to it left here - especially not an 'advertisement' and a link to the version that is for sale!

[Juicetyger]

[Andy K]

[Silverlion]

[Jeph]

I'd advocate adding a clause to the effect of "be a dear and leave your 24-hour version up on the site even if you go on to publish the game," but legal stuff makes me twitchy.

Twitch, twitch.

It doesn't really seem good policy to take the 24 hour version down when you've got a commercial one, anyway. I mean, dosn't the whole Free Preview thing pretty much always invigorate sales? And, honestly, 1km1kt.net entries have more Google power than RPGNow entries. With P&P and even Vs. Monsters, the 1km1kt slot shows up first. Google power is good. Giving up google power is bad.

--Jeff

[dantai]

Sorry, i've been out of the loop for a while.

Hi everyone, I'm Joe who wrote the game.
I go by many names...

I'd like to thank everyone who took an interest in the game, and especially Keeton who's been really great about everything!

Ideally as the author, I would have liked to keep the free version online at 1KMT1KMT.

However, UKG publishing have taken legal advice on UK copyright law and that's why they requested the submission be taken down.

If anyone does want a free 24hr version you can remove (NOSPAM) & email me
shadowofpod(NOSPAM)@hotmail.com

If there's sufficient demand I think I can re-submit P&P at a later date and it wouldn't interfere with copyright - but I need to check that out properly.

Thanks everyone

Joe J Prince

[Juicetyger]

Thanks for the update Joe! I hope the product does really well. If you don't mind me asking,what kind of steps did you take to get your work published? I'm sure some of our readers might benefit from your experience.

Keeton